Sin City

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"I see it as mindless and a creative failure".
Did you forget you typed those words?

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I did. I can't remember every word I write in long threads. I overstated it there. Anyway, whether I said that or not, I wanted to qualify those ideas, and I didn't state it that way in my review, which is my best statement of what I think. "Mindless and a creative failure" are oversimplifications. Sorry also about the mistake on the author's name; I have corrected it. Funny you didn't tell me about it before. Are you just now reading my review carefully? You never responded to my references to Rumble Fish, Clockwork Orange, the Crow movies, and Waking Life or said how Sin City stacks up against them. I know it's from a comic book. But it's not a comic book as you say in this last post ("It's a COMIC BOOK. ").

I don't see where I ever have said we need to "to search for meticulous subtexts and transmogrifications or superfluous stupendicies." I just want to discuss the movie.

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We don't have to "dig deep" to have a clear discussion on this movie.

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Maybe, maybe not. Depends on what you mean by "dig deep." If it means examining your arguments and presenting a coherent case, you do need to dig deep. If you mean "to search for meticulous subtexts and transfmogrifications or superfluous stupendicies," you don't. I want to have "a clear discussion" though: whatever it takes to do that.

If you're tired out and you don't want to discuss Sin City any more but just to opine I guess there's not much more we can say on this thread. I did appreciate your expanding your comments on the movie. I think there's more to say about any movie than "I liked it" or "I hated it," always. I should think if Sin City is as good as you say, it'd be worth debating, and there'd still be a lot more to bring up, but so be it.

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I don't understand people's positions here.

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Then you're in a weak position. I understand your position. Why don't you understand mine? The value of these forums is to arrive at understandings. We don't have to agree with each other's opinions to understand them.

Sin City stacks up well with the films you cite and towers over them. (although Clockwork Orange has real similarities)

It may have more in common with The Warriors or The Lost Boys or Total Recall.

But comparisons with other films do not feel right to me.
This film has an integrity of vision, a passion that screams at me that I have nothing but pagan idolatry for.

I cannot enunciate any more about this movie. It's been draining and frustrating for me.

I retire from this thread.

Jane Austen's "Sin City", now there is an idea.

Let's see, we'll make one of the whores of a slightly lower social class than the other whores (which will be a source of discomfort for her) and we'll have Clive Owen as a rich dandy about town who likes her the best, but of course he won't be able to simply reveal his true intentions without causing quite a stir.

This film hasn't been released in the UK yet but it's outstanding to see how quickly the posts have soared on this topic.

It seems a shame that not many films can draw this level of discussion or is Sin City really that special?

Cheers Trev.

Trevor:

As I said in a previous post it's visually very interesting and well done. But so was Aha's "Take on Me" video. The film has a weak cast, bad dialogue and poor delivery.

Chris Knipp ( 04-22-2005 01:40 AM) comments are a great example of his ability to directly respond to critical comments in a well developed and point-by-point manner that increases understanding, provides a substantive qualitative enhancement of intellectual thought. Somebody needs to nominate this person to Film Professor emeritus, at least some honorary degree behind his name on this website. It's really a honor to have somebody of his caliber take the time to actually meaninful respond to my ideas and thoughts. The internet can sure be a truly remarkable invention at times.

tabuno:

Too much polysyllabic elocution will invariably lead to discomfiture on the part of the reader which may lead to consternation and bewilderment.

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(Originally posted by trevor826.)
It seems a shame that not many films can draw this level of discussion or is Sin City really that special?

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I agree. But whenever there are passionate advocates and people with something to say who don't agree, a discussion happens. I think you can learn from any debate so long as people stick with it and keep their minds open and their tempers under control. It takes some patience sometimes to recognize that others may listen, but you're not likely to get them to agree. My interest is to have a good debate. The debate is of value in itself.

tabuno-- You're too kind, but thanks anyway.

"I will not debate you, Jerry."


Steve Buscemi, "Fargo"

Cinema news that slakes my thirst:

Frank Miller is directing 2 (two!) back-to-back sequels to the best film of the year.

Make 'em all, Frank!

Here's my hope for part 1:

http://images.darkhorse.com/covers/med/s/sclll.jpg

I feel some monumental numerical moment being the one hundreth post on this film. So I'll make it count.

They can create a cartoon about the Nazi's butchering Jews during World War II in the most stylistic fashion, filled with artful angles and splashes of contemporary art, but making it into a film doesn't make it right, or even morally correct; for "Sin City" is its equivalent. This brutal and downright vicious representation is filled with so much graphic violence as to become reprehensible. None of the violence in this film furthers the plot, other than to glorify its own existance.

And so, this generation, bombarded with extremely violent images in comics, video games, on television and in the movies... thinks very little when they see real people get beaten, cut, burned or shot. They've become desensitized to the ramifications of how such violence impacts the reasoning part of the mind, or the psychological impllications of repeated viewing.

"Sin City" isn't so much a graphic film filled with two dimensional characters spitting out terribly cliches from 1950's crime novels, as it an epitaph to a generation bored with wrestlers simply matching strength against each other. Instead, they want blood, gore, chairs to the head, and heads bashed senselessly till they're unconscious. This isn't boxing, the most brutal of sports. This is bloodlust, the kind found in arenas two thousand years ago, when the crowd called out for the head of the defeated, so they could look at it more closely, stuck up on a pole, as they exited the Colosseum.

When we shake our heads in wonder why 18 year old Marines enter the house of some innocent Iraqis they regard as the enemy, and slaughter them grinning as they pull the trigger... think of "Sin City".... think of "Wolfenstein." Think of who is the agressor and who is the victim. In coming to watch violence on this level, we are all vicitims and the next generation, guinea pigs for our lack of social reasoning along with antipathy for peace and understanding.

You'll definitely be missed, BRITTANY MURPHY. (a/k/a Shellie)
I loved you in Sin City.
Thanks for that Tonight Show interview where you made it clear that Frank Miller is a comic book GOD.
You're immortalized in SIN CITY.
That's enough.
Sleep well Girl...