You sort of "buried" (though you're getting plenty of hits over here) your comments on Sin City and I replied to them in part over on the Sin City thread, quoting what I thought was the key passage summarzing your response and repeating a bit what I said to that here earlier http://www.filmwurld.com/forums/show...155#post10155.
I have not seen Mouchette, and so maybe it's not surprising that I can't quite see what you mean by saying of her " her burden is heavier than the condemned man's imprisonment or the county priest's illness.." Why? Your remarks about this film are very general in nature using words like pain suffering innocent compassion piety hypocrisy grace….I don't get a feel for what's actually going on in the film as a film and a specific human document frame by frame, even though you do summarize her torments, also in general words -- humiliated beaten raped belittled burdened ostracized.. It seems to me that specific, dogged detail, rather than grand generalizations, are typical of Bresson's way of working in his later films, however symbolic the events may be meant to be. Apart from that, it is true as you yourself say that you haven't replied to every query I made, in fact you're just commented on Mouchette.Well we don't have to restrict ourselves to one possible interpretation of one film because we've both seen a goodly sample of Bresson's oeurve, you nine (or is it ten?) and I seven of his films (with one, Au hazard Balthazar, lined up ready to watch and probably Mouchette in the offing if I honor this discussion). Maybe we could go through the films and rate them on a scale of …. Something or other … which is obviously silly… as to their degree of determinism. But I also asked some broader questions by implication about the role of determinism and pessimism in film and I'd like us to discuss those, with Bresson perhaps as a starting point.Quote:
I think it's possible to interpret the narrative arc of this film as a deterministic one, much more so than any of the other 9 Bressons I've seen_deterministic in the basic sense, a view that denies the importance and significance of free will. But I think it would be a mistake to make this generalization based one possible interpretation of one film.
Repeating and summarizing my queries:
--"It's too facile to say Bresson's world view is deterministic." Why? Can you enlarge on that point? If Bresson's "world view" isn't simply deterministic, what is it, then? Why can't one call it "deterministic"? What is the more subtle, complex, less "facile" way that you propose of describing his "world view"?
--Do you acknowledge that there are some filmmakers whose work is relentlessly pessimistic? If so, why should such filmmakers not be described as "deterministic"?
--Why emphasize the negative? . . .Why not be life-affirming, like Renoir?
--What's the relevence of American culture to this discussion? Does American culture in its essence rule out a sense of "unavoidable fate" that is beyond the reaches of "mere cause and effect"? Is such a world view really anathema in our American culture, and is it true that therefore any negative reaction to the tendencies in Bresson's films means we are helplessly acting out a pattern of cultural "determinism"? If so, why is Bresson so admired by American film lovers? Are they merely knee-jerk rejectionists of their own culture?
