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Thread: SNOWDEN (Oliver Stone 2016)

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    SNOWDEN (Oliver Stone 2016)

    OLIVER STONE: SNOWDEN (2014)


    JOSEPH GORDON-LEVITT AND BEN SCHNETZER IN SNOWDEN

    The man who showed the extent of US global surveillance

    Has Stone's Snowden gotten such mixed reviews for political reasons? Or because people have dismissed Stone for doing nothing for a long time as impressive as his earlier films? Or because Laura Poitras already covered this material in Citizenfour, and won the Best Documentary Oscar for it?

    Actually, Snowden is an important film and (as has been said) a serious return to form for Oliver Snowden, albeit executed in a lower-keyed, more sober style that never calls attention to itself and, save for the richness of its detail and the excellence of its execution, follows the outlines of any conventional biopic tied in with contemporary news.

    Snowden's most tense moments are nothing more dramatic than the interactions of its subject, intelligence cyber operative Edward Snowden (Joseph Gordon-Levitt), with his girlfriend Lindsay Mills (Shailene Woodley) or his coworkers and contrasting mentors, suave and dandyish leader Corbin O'Brian (Rhys Ifans) and sidelined maverick Hank Forrester (Nicolas Cage) , or his mere transfer of a raft of secret documents to a little USB drive, or hastily sneaking out of his Hong Kong hotel. In fact Laura Poitras's filming of the Hong Kong hotel room is , here too, for structural purposes, the central locus, though with Poitras, invisible in Citizenfour, actually shown this time (played by Melissa Leo).

    All this may seem unpromising. But this is a tense and exciting movie. It spells out much that Poitras' Citizenfour omits, not just about Edward Snowden but about the power structure he became a part of in his young, brilliant career.

    Stone, with his cowriter Kieran Fitzgerald, drawing on books by Luke Harding and Russian lawyer Anatoly Kucherena, shows in detail how Snowden came to do what he did, from his departure from the Army Rangers due to broken legs to his CIA and NSA training and service and work in Virginia, Geneva, Tokyo, back to Virginia, and Hawaii, to the hotel room in Hong Kong. This is the portrait of a man that may provide topics for intense debate. (It doesn't tell all, by any means. For example, it says Snowden left high school to earn money to support his parents, but we never see his parents or learn anything about them.)

    This is another important film this year (like Zero Days and Lo and Behold) that focuses on the dangers to both the individual and the state of a world dominated by computers and the Internet - where everything is connected and privacy is disappearing. There is debate over whether Snowden is a whistleblower and hero, or a villainous leaker. People differ on whether Stone's film is neutral or hagiography. It is not neutral, but it steers clear of hagiography. Trump, Obama, and Hilary Clinton are united, as the movie gives plenty of clips to show, in regarding Snowden as guilty of crimes and needing to come back from asylum in Russia to "face the music."

    Whatever you think about his actions, it's a fact that Edward Snoden was Time Magazine's 2013 "Person of the Year," even though they called him "The Dark Prophet" and said he "pulled off the year's most spectacular heist." The journalists who brought his revelations to the public won awards for their articles doing so. Snowden's revelations have led to changes in NSA policy voted for my Congress and approved by President Obama. Chelsea Manning, who came clean and remained in the US, is serving 35 years in prison. It's also a fact that Obama has ruthlessly tried more whistleblowers under the WWI Espionage Act than any previous president, and Snowden could not have brought the NSA practices to light as he did through channels or as a whistleblower as Hilary Clinton and others have suggested.

    As A.O. Scott notes in his review of Snowden for the NYTimes, "What used to be paranoia — the idea, say, that your electronic appliances are spying on you — looks nowadays like blunt realism." That Orwellian futurist possibility is something Werner Herzog looks at in his Low and Behold: Reveries of the Connected World.

    There are many telling scenes in the film, but perhaps the most telling are those between Snowden and another flashy and in his case pretty young CIA cyber-whiz, Gabriel Sol (Ben Schnetzer), who first shows Ed the extent to which the system they wielded could sneak instantly and without even rubber-stamp legal authorization into people's - anyone's - private lives. He calls the shocked Snowden "Snow White." Snowden is the innocent and pure one. He's a cyber monk: he believes this a sacred calling, and he does not drink or smoke. The toll taken by his stressed-out dedication repeatedly jeopardizes his otherwise solid relationship with serious amateur photographer Lindsay, as well as eventually bringing on epileptic attacks he'd not known he was subject to. While staying close in the absorbing scene-by-scene story to details of what appears to be fact (there is plenty of invention), Stone and company vividly convey the constricting bubble in which Snowden lived, where he was torn between intense patriotism, a conviction that he was uniquely gifted to serve the country's security against massive outside hackers, and his competing sense that it was all going way too far and that he was trapped in practices that violated basic constitutional rights.

    The real-life Snowden, who speaks at the end of the film, and who is living somewhere in Russia with Lindsay, has often been heard from remotely in public forums (as here), and always says he's not a hero or a villain but just an American citizen and that it's the issues that matter and not him. But Stone's movie shows us this everyman, who completed a five-hour CIA test in 38 minutes and threw away an extremely lucrative job to serve principles, is a long way from being ordinary.

    Snowden, 134 mins., debuted in Comic-Con in San Diego in July, and 9 Sept. 2016 at Toronto; it opened in the US 16 Sept.
    Last edited by Chris Knipp; 09-17-2016 at 01:27 AM.

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    Citizenfour...gotta see that one.

    I don't like Joseph Gordon-Leavitt. There is something I despise about him- his opportunism. I wonder how he went from a goofy little kid on "Family Ties"- a gagger of a sitcom- to big Hollywood actor. Somebody needs to explain who he killed to get where he is...it baffles me, because I don't believe his performances, I never give it up for his characters, and that's his fault and the director's.

    I saw Oliver Stone being interviewed on the cbc at TIFF last week, and I was horrified to hear him say that "Billions of dollars are at stake!" In reference to the NSA'S shenanigans. ????
    Canuck reporter Wendy Mesley never pressed him on it, and Oliver seemed cranky. he's 70 now, and he said he has a hard time getting out of bed.
    "Set the controls for the heart of the Sun" - Pink Floyd

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    Be that as it may, and in some ways I liked Joe better in the past than lately too, this is still a well-made, highly relevant film and the lousy reviews it's gotten are a scandal. Citizenfour (which should be seen, and won the Oscar) does not render this redundant. They complement each other around an important topic. Lives are at stake. See beyond the vessel to the contents, Johann.

    Have you seen latter Days, Manic, Mysterious Skin, Stop-Loss, 500 Days of Summer, Brick, Hesher, Premium Rush, Looper, The Walk? Gordon-Levitt has assembled an impressive and remarkably varied, adventurous and interesting resume and I have followed him closely. He has earned recognition slowly and patiently and there is nothing about his career that smacks of opportunism. On the contrary he has tended to take offbeat roles that would not gain him high visibility but would take him in new directions.
    Last edited by Chris Knipp; 09-24-2016 at 07:52 PM.

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    I'll see it, because I see every Oliver Stone movie, but I'm not expecting much.
    Lives are at stake, and it enrages me that the government feels they need complete access to every person's data, for "security reasons". Um, if the government did it's job as opposed to losing say, trillions at the Pentagon here, billions there, then maybe they would have some safety mechanisms in place. 9\11 PROVED the government did not have anybody's back except the WARMONGERS.

    AND OBAMA...vetoing that 9/11 bill...if that doesn't scream "I AM PART OF THE SAUDI ALLIANCE", THEN WHAT DOES? yeah, you got bin Laden, BARACK. (so we're told). But 15 years later and there is no JUSTICE for the massacre under Dubya's watch.

    I think snowden may help educate high school students, but what about those of us who know that Obama is wrong?
    "Set the controls for the heart of the Sun" - Pink Floyd

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    Did you know that Leavitt is also rumoured to have sacrificed his own brother to join the $20 million club?
    He has interesting parts, but I am leery of him.
    "Set the controls for the heart of the Sun" - Pink Floyd

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    Another thing to consider about Gordo, Chris, is that his showing no signs of opportunism means that yes, he is a really good and dedicated actor. In fact, I am the only one (besides Oliver Stone perhaps, and why he probably hired him) who notices his "grey man" demeanor. "Grey man" is a military term for a guy who doesn't stand out, a guy who's aloof, who does exactly what he's told in as much as it helps him in the ranks. and JoGo fits that bill to a T. I took real notice of him in The Dark Knight Rises, which he's good in, yet I still don't give it up for his character- he just fit into the whole ensemble.
    "Set the controls for the heart of the Sun" - Pink Floyd

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    Chris, does this film do anything other than tell us who Snowden is? Other than being just another of Stone's skilled "pat" biographies?
    What do you leave the theatre thinking?
    That shit is hopeless? Or that something can be done?
    Because that's what I want to see, a movie that can affect change, which Oliver has proven he is capable of.
    I watched Sidney Lumet's amazing NETWORK recently, and the name Snowden is part of the story...any connection? Is this all one big punk? are we dupes? MY RADAR PICKS UP A LOT, and maybe it means zilch...but I don't think so. :)
    Last edited by Johann; 09-26-2016 at 07:07 AM.
    "Set the controls for the heart of the Sun" - Pink Floyd

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    All this is without your having seen Stone's new film.
    So you're saying "Gordo" is guilty of opportunism because he doesn't show it, 'cause he's such a good actor? You're running circles around yourself, man. You have absolutely nothing to go on other than an irrational dislike of the guy. Your blaming his brother's death on him is a really low resorting to tabloid lies to support your mindless character assassination. Such talk has no place here.

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    It seems like tabloid lies, but I'm not so sure.

    Professor Griff of Public Enemy is on record (and radio interview tape) talking about a sinister secret in the music industry and Hollywood- that if you commit a blood sacrifice, you are granted fame and fortune, and Griff brought up KANYE WEST as an example. Griff states that Kanye wanted fame and fortune so bad he was willing to sacrifice his own mother at the right time. (and did). Now that is some serious allegation, no? You don't go on national radio and say something crazy like that unless it's true. Kanye has never sued Griff, and blood sacrifice pages on the internet are Legion, Chris. that's where I found JoGo's name, listed with many many other stars...

    Insane shit goes on, Chris. I'M OPEN TO ANYTHING.
    Last edited by Johann; 09-26-2016 at 07:31 AM.
    "Set the controls for the heart of the Sun" - Pink Floyd

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    I should expand on this a bit, because I never want to character assassinate anybody unless you are Stephen Harper and his ilk. (and how can you assassinate them anyway, with no character, no morals, no honor, no integrity?)

    If JoGo (yes, I've just coined that term) had no connection to his brother's death, then he should be going full raging tits legal on these blood sacrifice pages. THAT is character assassination--and I wasn't the one who came up with this allegation. You think I mindlessly made it up? nope. I always have sources for what I say. It is in the realm of possibility. That's why I'm open to it. I seriously hope it's just some malicious, vile bunk. But what if it is true? How would you feel about that? And by the way, I noticed that these blood sacrifices have many participants, but the lists do not include many many stars. So yeah, a lot of them seem to be people who otherwise would never have become famous, such as Kanye, Kris Jenner, LADY GAGA (ugh-arguably the most loathesome), Mark Ruffalo, JAY-Z, ETC ETC

    IT SEEMS TOTALLY TABLOID TRASH, and that's how they get away with it. Marilyn Monroe was a blood sacrifice, and her death is tabloid-ish, isn't it?
    "Set the controls for the heart of the Sun" - Pink Floyd

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    Also, Professor Griff is a man I really admire- he's hardcore about speaking the truth. It got him into many controversies over the years and even got fired from the group for being too honest! How insane is that? One of my favorite things he ever said was (paraphrase) "You disagree with me? OK. Then make your case. Because I'll prove mine to you. That's how you get caught up".

    BTW, his response to Kanye saying he's moving to AFRICA if cops keep killing blacks was priceless:
    "Take your ass to Africa then. And take your rich white whore wife with you. This nigger plays both sides! He's sitting with $100 million while we're living paycheck to paycheck"
    "Set the controls for the heart of the Sun" - Pink Floyd

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    I don't know about Professor Griff, but the statements you link to him sound pretty over-the-top. But regardless of source, I would never repeat derogatory information about a well known person without careful fact-checkiing, and personally my shit-detector works pretty well on its own. Tabloid trash is always out there and is just that. I also don't invent slangy cute names for people, whether I intend to slur them or not.

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    I don't invent names either, but this one fits for me. He bought the ticket, he can take the ride. He's a big boy, he can handle it. If "BRANGELINA" is accepted by all, then my little JoGo can sail past the censors.
    Professor Griff is over-the-top, in the best possible way. He is the anti-Kanye, just like Full Metal Jacket is the anti-Rambo.
    "Set the controls for the heart of the Sun" - Pink Floyd

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    Chris, does this film do anything other than tell us who Snowden is?
    Are there any solutions to the NSA problem offered in the film? Besides Edward himself, which you said he appears at the end?
    "Set the controls for the heart of the Sun" - Pink Floyd

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    Most folks just call him Joe, but I admit you did make a catchy one. Your tabloid career awaits you, Johann.

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