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Thread: Best movies of 2017

  1. #61
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    "Twin Peaks" ? Yes, I followed the original on TV.
    I don't think figuring out the ending is a very worthwhile activity. Willing suspension is the best way to enjoy the wild invention that is David Lynch.
    There has been some discussion of whether this new extension can be a "film" to list as a "best film" of the year and, indeed, accepting TV series as "films" seems like a bad direction. But I might make an exception in the case of Lynch, as one would accept other miniseries that could be considered artistic long films, such as Olivier Assayas' 2010 much-admired Carlos, starring Edgar Ramírez.
    Last edited by Chris Knipp; 04-12-2018 at 07:20 PM.

  2. #62
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    Spielberg just argued to the contrary, decrying "Netflix" as undermining the award process. Several outlets carried the story. Here's a link to one: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/films/20...eserve-oscars/
    Colige suspectos semper habitos

  3. #63
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    But now three-time Oscar-winning director Steven Spielberg has said that films made by Netflix should not be awarded Oscars simply because they have had a short cinematic release, and called the service: "a clear and present danger to film-goers". - Telegraph.
    Good for him. That is a different issue, though, from whether or not "Twin Peaks" is a film, I thought, which is about length. Format. Rather than presentation method.
    Last edited by Chris Knipp; 04-15-2018 at 10:12 AM.

  4. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by cinemabon View Post
    Having seen smidgens of it here and there (I only just got Showtime back); I wondered, Oscar, what you thought of the ending. I've read several interpretations. Unfortunately, Chris said he hasn't seen it. (Did you see the original, Chris?) The first series which aired decades ago starred Kyle MacLachlin, who also starred in the Lynch production, "Blue Velvet," fresh off his debut in "Dune." The first series attracted an unusual crowd of murder mystery and sci-fi/horror fans as Lynch played to several audiences (ABC network TV). The first series ended (mostly due to ratings) with no resolution. That they brought it back spoke more to Lynch wanting closure, I believe. I'm certain fans of the series must have hounded him to death.

    Speaking of death, many actors connected to the series either died during or just after the shooting concluded (Harry Dean Stanton and others). Even David Bowie is featured with a dubbed voice. Twin Peaks - the Return is available to stream. Lynch premiered the series at last year's Cannes. The audience responded with a five-minute standing ovation.

    Interesting choice, Oscar.
    Apologies for taking so long to respond to your query, and also for not providing my interpretation of the ending; being lazy I guess since it would require stringing many thoughts together.I am happy Lynch again decided to make it strange in unexpected ways, to continue moving forward with his characteristic aesthetic. Again, he gives us a series the public is not quite ready for. He breaks with narrative convention in a more pronounced way in this series and you can thank technology (CGI, etc) for the means or tools to do it. The 2017 series incorporates purely avant-grade, basically non-narrative, expressionistic image-making and the sound designed and mixed by David Lynch himself is a crucial element in achieving the emotional, cognitive and physical effects the material aims to elicit.

    Thanks for the post.

  5. #65
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    Let ambiguity and nihilism reign supreme!
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  6. #66
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    I'm watching the new Twin Peaks now. But with 18 55-minute episodes, it's a lot to watch and I hope I can cancel my Amazon-Showtime free trial in time. 7 days to watch 18 hours. Julie Muncy, a Wired writer, has a piece in Polygon about intentionally crude effects and new technology used in the series. Frankly, I think the straightforward noir-soap scenes, are better and more important than any of the surreal effects, though they are necessary Lynchian embroidery, of course.

    Watched John Krasinski's new monster movie A Quiet Place today. Miraculously simple and effective - the word-of-mouth hype I've been hearing was justified.
    Last edited by Chris Knipp; 04-25-2018 at 09:49 AM.

  7. #67
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    A little research can't hurt since we're talking about the continuation of something that began 25 years ago.
    "An academic definition of Lynchian might be that the term 'refers to a particular kind of irony where the very macabre and he very mundane combine in such a way as to reveal the former's perpetual containment within the latter.' But like postmodern or pornographic, Lynchian is one of those Potter Stewart-type words that's definable only ostensively --i.e., we know it when we see it. Ted Bundy wasn't particularly Lynchian, but good old Jeffrey Dahmer, with his victim's various anatomies neatly separated and stored in his fridge alongside his chocolate milk and Shedd Spread, was thoroughly Lynchian. . ."
    -from "David Lynch Keeps His Head," in A Supposedly Fun Thing I'll Never Do Again by David Foster Wallace, 1997, which I thought it might be time to get out and read again.

  8. #68
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    By the way ~ Kazuo Miyagawa


    Floating Weeds

    A retrospective is being held of the cinematography of Kazuo Miyagawa (1908-1999), whose contribution to the world's lensing is unbelievably important, it turns out (Ozu, Mizoguchi, Kurosawa, Ichikawa). It's at MoMA and the Japan Society in New York. See this MoMA announcement:

    https://www.moma.org/calendar/film/4955?locale=en

  9. #69
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    I finished TWIN PEAKS: THE RETURN (2017). Learned a word. Tulpa. http://twinpeaks.wikia.com/wiki/Tulpa
    This is pivotal for the whole plot of Dale Cooper's multiple personalities. The series could be calledTulpa-ing. More than the "irony" of the "macabre and the mundane" the focus seems to be on the spiritual and the paranormal.

  10. #70
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    Ending of Twin Peaks: The Return explained.


    Photo: Suzanne Tenner/Showtime [Vulture] Sheryl Lee and Kyle MacLaughlan in TPR, E.18

    Even somebody like me who doesn't look for "meanings" of things might need help following "The Return," and that's why I looked up "tulpa," which seems like a key concept in the plot concerning multiple characters, most notably Dale Cooper and and his new avatars all played by Kyle MacLaughlan. But, it turns out, there are multiple other "tulpas," which are defined on that website as "conjured duplicates of individuals." They appear in Dale's case to be more like messed up or garbled clones.

    You will find a Vulture piece by Devon Ivie based on a book by Mark Frost called Twin Peaks: The Final Dossier, itself a sequel to the Times bestselling Secret History of Twin Peaks. I think she (Ms. Ivie) notes that the newly reborn Cooper, when he picks up who he thinks is the 25-years-older Laura in Odyssa (Texas, though it's left vague), goes over some kind of space-time-spirit zone at a certain mileage point, which may be where things go wrong with finding Laura's mother in Twin Peaks.

    Cinemabon and others seeking the "meaning" of all or parts of Twin Peaks: The Return might be helped by consulting a fan or reference website called Twin Peaks wiki.
    Last edited by Chris Knipp; 04-28-2018 at 08:27 PM.

  11. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by cinemabon View Post
    Let ambiguity and nihilism reign supreme!
    Yes, perhaps ambiguity is right. But perhaps fragmentation and even incompleteness are words that come closer to characterizing the series as a piece of narrative. I don't think the word "nihilism" applies here. In Lynch's diegesis, there are characters who are invariably sympathetic and guided by the desire to do good. There is a clear "good side" to root for and a degree of optimism that they may prevail.

  12. #72
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    I was thinking the same. It occurred to me that surrealism is not the art of nihilism. There is hope in it and in Lynch's world.


    Nihilistic?
    Last edited by Chris Knipp; 05-05-2018 at 07:53 PM.

  13. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris Knipp View Post
    I looked up "tulpa," which seems like a key concept in the plot concerning multiple characters, most notably Dale Cooper and and his new avatars all played by Kyle MacLaughlan. But, it turns out, there are multiple other "tulpas," which are defined on that website as "conjured duplicates of individuals".
    These conjured duplicates in Lynch's films at least since (and perhaps most memorably in) Lost Highway partake of very old traditions of character splitting, alter egos, and doppelgängers (a term made famous in the 19th century and still widely used). Stevenson's "Case of Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde" (1886) is a key work in this tradition. In cinema, the convention goes back to Melies, who doubled himself 9 times for "One-Man Band" (1900).

  14. #74
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    Thanks for the historical footnote. The Tulpas in The Return aren't doppelgängers to my mind, because they exist in separate universes or on separate planes. Nabokov made interesting and important use of doppelgängers. They are central toLolita and Despair. Claire Qulity is a mocking, pursuing doppelgänger of Humbert Humert. It is best if they cross paths. One's doppelgänger is someone one is astonished to meet. Does that happen in Twin Peaks: The Return? No. With Nabokov the author is famously always visibly at work. With David Lynch not. It's as if he's channeling the unconscious. Therein lies the difference between doppelgängers and tulpas. But in artistic terms they are certainly related, they are both doubles. I hope you have all read Lolita, one of the greatest masterpieces of American literature of the second half of the twentieth century (1955, when it caused a shock and thrill you can't even imagine). But at least you've all surely seen Kubrick's adaptation (1962, when it caused only mild excitement of the casting of an unknown, Sue Lyon as the nymphet). In Kubrick's film the encounter between Quilty and Humbert, in a brilliantly improvised sequence by Peter Sellers as Quilty, to my mind is the highlight, which transcends the otherwise pedestrian adaptation (as many more parts of the movie Clockwork Orange transcend Burgess' hard-to-read novel). You can't adapt the novel Lolita, can't do it justice, but Lynne's more pedestrian version is just as good or better if you really want to revisit the shadow of the novel on the screen. James Mason, though great is too strong an actor for the devious, secretive Humbert Humbert. The Web is loaded with academic papers about this stuff. Here's one, comparing the encounter between Quilty and Hubert in the book and both movies) that comes up right away:
    http://www.alphavillejournal.com/Iss...leRichards.pdf

    From the University of Florida. Maybe you actually wrote it, Oscar, as this dude's double.
    Last edited by Chris Knipp; 05-06-2018 at 02:29 AM.

  15. #75
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    You must confront your shadow self- your doppelganger- to pass through the black lodge. The implication is everyone has a doppelganger.
    Tulpas are artificial doubles created with a specific purpose.
    You can have a doppelganger (Mr C) and a tulpa double (the Dougie Jones whose head popped)
    Tulpas are created by a person's will. doppelgangers are a result. not controllable
    -reddit comments
    Last edited by Chris Knipp; 05-06-2018 at 04:07 AM.

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